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JT Moderator	Message Posted: Apr 19, 2003 11:01:00 PM Ignore JT Report Abuse Is there a conspiracy in effect to prevent the use/development of alternative fuels? Yes No Unsure Post your thoughts about this poll below.

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Message Posted: Apr 19, 2003 11:01:00 PM

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Is there a conspiracy in effect to prevent the use/development of alternative fuels?
Yes
No
Unsure

Post your thoughts about this poll below.

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KAD-483 Champion Author Akron Posts:6,811 Points:1,410,360 Joined:Sep 2003	Message Posted: Nov 7, 2003 11:32:22 PM Ignore KAD-483 Report Abuse Yes
Tried Champion Author Quad Cities Posts:3,034 Points:488,450 Joined:Aug 2003	Message Posted: Nov 7, 2003 9:52:11 PM Ignore Tried Report Abuse If you mean alternative to Gasoline, absolutely yes! - Tried http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gasbuddy
KillYourTV Champion Author Colorado Springs Posts:8,204 Points:1,740,770 Joined:Apr 2002	Message Posted: Nov 7, 2003 9:47:28 PM Ignore KillYourTV Report Abuse Most of the people carping for alternative fuels don't acknowledge the alternatives already available. When they say "alternative fuels" they mean "FREE fuels".
ak4ron Champion Author Alaska Posts:12,400 Points:2,322,445 Joined:Aug 2003	Message Posted: Nov 2, 2003 5:36:39 PM Ignore ak4ron Report Abuse Unsure, "Paul Harvey news and comments" said that the germans have developed a engine that will run on "Borax" and water. I would like to see one and hear more about it. This was about four or five months ago.
acrider54 Champion Author British Columbia Posts:14,088 Points:2,527,835 Joined:Mar 2003	Message Posted: Nov 2, 2003 9:48:11 AM Ignore acrider54 Report Abuse YES!
Road Dog Veteran Author San Francisco Posts:271 Points:4,810 Joined:Nov 2003	Message Posted: Nov 1, 2003 11:53:34 PM Ignore Road Dog Report Abuse Check out Bio-diesel. I burned a mixture of 20 percent in my truck when I was in seattle. The truck ran great! The stuff is made out of recycled vegetable oil. It can be burned in any diesel engine without modifications and at any mixture up to 100% pure. Can be made from soybeans or anything you get vegetable oil from. Low toxic emissions also. Perhaps if all diesel is mixed with bio-diesel there could be a big reduction of import oil right now. No need for any special infrastructure also. So why is there not any TAX incentives to burn this stuff?
tubie Champion Author Los Angeles Posts:700,319 Points:2,589,105 Joined:Feb 2003	Message Posted: Nov 1, 2003 7:49:43 PM Ignore tubie Report Abuse Not sure.
Houckster Champion Author Atlanta Posts:6,534 Points:631,605 Joined:Sep 2003	Message Posted: Nov 1, 2003 6:45:22 AM Ignore Houckster Report Abuse There is neither enough economic incentive or governmental pressure for us to really get serious about alternative fuels. There is also a major disincentive in the tremendous amount of retraining that will be necessary to develop enough technicians capable of servicing cars with alternative fuel systems. To make things worse, these cars will probably be much more complex. This, coupled with the fact that the quality control of American manufacturers is still not what it should be so will mean that when we do switch, service technicians will be in such short supply that we could have a real mess on our hands. Things aren't that great now! Yet, the environment may not wait for us to get ready and neither will many of our neighbors in the world who are frustrated with our foot-dragging. The emissions of carbon dioxide in the atmostphere and other negative impacts we are causing may impose conditions on us that will make the costs of converting to a new transportation technology pale in comparison. At the minimum, we need to get in step with other countries that are responding to reality faster than we are. As the largest energy-consuming country in the world, we should really be at the forefront.
Mistomax Champion Author Des Moines Posts:3,156 Points:591,695 Joined:May 2003	Message Posted: Nov 1, 2003 4:40:13 AM Ignore Mistomax Report Abuse The problem is that all of the alternative fuels I've seen suck compared to oil. Oil is tough to beat because it has a lot of chemical energy stored in it right out of the ground. All the other things we've thought of either don't produce much energy (like solar powered anything), or they take almost as much energy to produce as they give back (like ethanol). Or, they take way more energy to produce than they give back (hydrogen). There just isn't any incentive for anybody to use anything but oil right now, because it's just simply the best, that is, cheapest and easiest, source of fuel.
MEB Champion Author Atlanta Posts:4,570 Points:632,315 Joined:Sep 2003	Message Posted: Oct 31, 2003 4:38:31 PM Ignore MEB Report Abuse Aloha Jon You mentioned GM. Patent 3996906 and 3851633 Lets see if this link will come up.If not here is the direct link to the patent office search link.Just put 3996906 in the search line and GO !!! http://patft.uspto.gov/netahtml/srchnum.htm and maybe http://patft.uspto.gov/netahtml/srchnum.htm
MEB Champion Author Atlanta Posts:4,570 Points:632,315 Joined:Sep 2003	Message Posted: Oct 31, 2003 3:34:16 PM Ignore MEB Report Abuse You'll have to type it in. www.keelynet.com/energy/gunnhist.htm You can do a google search too vapor carbureator Have fun
MEB Champion Author Atlanta Posts:4,570 Points:632,315 Joined:Sep 2003	Message Posted: Oct 31, 2003 3:29:13 PM Ignore MEB Report Abuse Yes Vapor carbureator.Reseach is Massive compared to info with out computers in the early 1980's when i first looked into it. Check it out!! www.keelynet.com/energy/gunnhist.htm
AZQuailer Rookie Author Phoenix Posts:49 Points:56,935 Joined:Sep 2003	Message Posted: Oct 31, 2003 2:59:13 PM Ignore AZQuailer Report Abuse NO, just because things aren't perfect does not constitute a conspiracy.... Just because cars could be better doesn't mean a conspiracy,nor does car makers, oil producers, etc. making a profit. Conspiracy is a secret plan between agreeing factions. And just because a conspiracy theory fits the facts, it does not PROVE it is true.
Aloha jon Sophomore Author Orlando Posts:188 Points:38,125 Joined:Jun 2003	Message Posted: Jul 22, 2003 5:17:55 AM Ignore Aloha jon Report Abuse I do not know if it is true, but I heard long ago that after World War II, Chevron (Standard Oil of California), General Motors, and either Firestone or Goodyear work together to get people off the city buses and into cars in Southern California to boost their business. Why would oil companies want people to use other types of fuel? Although I have read that BP is into many different types of energy, but they are just one company.
steelplayer Rookie Author Bakersfield Posts:24 Points:8,780 Joined:Mar 2003	Message Posted: Apr 27, 2003 12:56:52 AM Ignore steelplayer Report Abuse I really believe there is a controlling factor in the development of advanced propulsion systems. If our computers and communications technology was advancing like the automobile developments we would be lucky to have a calculator or a digital watch by now. This is a sad state of affairs to have such antiquated technology of mobility in the current decade. What can be done?
onedavie Champion Author Virginia Posts:10,301 Points:2,526,590 Joined:Nov 2002	Message Posted: Apr 26, 2003 11:11:07 PM Ignore onedavie Report Abuse NO
Shnigs Rookie Author Regina Posts:5 Points:11,150 Joined:Apr 2003	Message Posted: Apr 26, 2003 5:29:28 PM Ignore Shnigs Report Abuse I like the "solar-powered" idea!!!
MORGY Champion Author Twin Cities Posts:1,430 Points:245,565 Joined:Oct 2002	Message Posted: Apr 26, 2003 4:58:22 PM Ignore MORGY Report Abuse Of course.....Those with a vested interest in one form of energy will fight like hell to keep their market share.....To hell with the public and clean air......
Matt!!! Rookie Author Winnipeg Posts:29 Points:10,610 Joined:Aug 2002	Message Posted: Apr 26, 2003 4:52:42 PM Ignore Matt!!! Report Abuse guess so
milo Champion Author Calgary Posts:3,129 Points:833,440 Joined:Aug 2001	Message Posted: Apr 26, 2003 10:58:16 AM Ignore milo Report Abuse Gatorade and gasoline do not relate but it is still interesting.
Siouxfan Champion Author Twin Cities Posts:13,848 Points:2,608,340 Joined:May 2001	Message Posted: Apr 26, 2003 10:01:14 AM Ignore Siouxfan Report Abuse I can't believe a second that anyone who is smart enough to develop a legitimate alternative to petrolium products would not also be smart enough to realize the money that they would make from it. It would be more than any oil company, or group of oil companies could ever pay to subdue the research. Also, if someone wasn't motivated by money, but the environmental impacts of petrolium, they would give the technology away to advance their cause, because "Mother, the Earth" is worth more than just money.
onedavie Champion Author Virginia Posts:10,301 Points:2,526,590 Joined:Nov 2002	Message Posted: Apr 26, 2003 9:50:13 AM Ignore onedavie Report Abuse No
sportsnut Rookie Author California Posts:72 Points:12,275 Joined:Mar 2003	Message Posted: Apr 25, 2003 10:01:17 PM Ignore sportsnut Report Abuse Hell Yes !
kmmesa Rookie Author Arizona Posts:1 Points:17,805 Joined:Feb 2003	Message Posted: Apr 25, 2003 4:33:13 PM Ignore kmmesa Report Abuse Does anyone recall an article ran in a few west coast newspapers a few years ago about an retired chemist living in Arizona who had derived a fuel from the byproduct of refining oil and Catapillar corp was going to test it? I saw one follow up to it and then never heard another mention of it.
Mark Veteran Author Twin Cities Posts:375 Points:169,930 Joined:May 2001	Message Posted: Apr 25, 2003 2:20:16 PM Ignore Mark Report Abuse I can't see how Gatorade and gasoline relate. Are you comparing apples to apples? Maybe I missed something...
Jamer Champion Author Orange County Posts:3,957 Points:695,550 Joined:Jul 2002	Message Posted: Apr 25, 2003 2:15:00 PM Ignore Jamer Report Abuse The Oil Companys have a Lobby Group second to none, and they spend millions of dollars every year to buy the Politicians Votes to keep the consumer dependent on oil products.
wench Rookie Author Atlanta Posts:85 Points:8,345 Joined:Mar 2003	Message Posted: Apr 25, 2003 1:49:29 PM Ignore wench Report Abuse We're never completely powerless. Every economic decision we make, has an impact, just not as big a one as we would like to see. It's like the gas outs, those only work if people completely change their habits and walk or bike ride so there is less use of petroleom (sp?) products overall. One day just doesn't have enough of an impact.
milo Champion Author Calgary Posts:3,129 Points:833,440 Joined:Aug 2001	Message Posted: Apr 25, 2003 1:37:54 PM Ignore milo Report Abuse we r powerless
catfish.TX Champion Author Texas Posts:2,322 Points:372,755 Joined:Mar 2003	Message Posted: Apr 25, 2003 10:23:27 AM Ignore catfish.TX Report Abuse Not a conspiracy, all company's involved in car or fuel have reason to like or dislike other car and fuel companies. What will drive alternative fuels is money, save the consumer money on another fuel and watch the paths being beening made to there product by fuel and car companies.
onedavie Champion Author Virginia Posts:10,301 Points:2,526,590 Joined:Nov 2002	Message Posted: Apr 25, 2003 9:05:00 AM Ignore onedavie Report Abuse NO
karmat Rookie Author Atlanta Posts:78 Points:10,065 Joined:Apr 2003	Message Posted: Apr 25, 2003 7:55:40 AM Ignore karmat Report Abuse "Big-Oil" is the reason that alternative fuel sources haven't been developed as fully as they could.
figment Rookie Author Austin Posts:6 Points:26,220 Joined:Mar 2003	Message Posted: Apr 25, 2003 7:47:18 AM Ignore figment Report Abuse The car makers have improved some..my current car with a 6 cyl. is getting better milage the my last car with a 4 cyl. but I think they could still do better.
kwzh Champion Author San Jose Posts:15,720 Points:2,730,380 Joined:Jul 2001	Message Posted: Apr 25, 2003 3:05:34 AM Ignore kwzh Report Abuse cali13: I believe the main problem with a solar-powered anything is that in order to be able to use it when the sun's not out, you need a rather unwieldy storage system for the energy you collect in the daytime.
cali13 Rookie Author Las Vegas Posts:1 Points:20,895 Joined:Mar 2003	Message Posted: Apr 24, 2003 2:52:17 PM Ignore cali13 Report Abuse They are making cars more fuel efficent now but why havent they made a solar powered one?? because money is more important than our environment.
GoeveH All-Star Author Toronto Posts:560 Points:688,155 Joined:Jan 2002	Message Posted: Apr 24, 2003 10:30:52 AM Ignore GoeveH Report Abuse I voted "yes", even though collusion seems more plausible than conspiracy. I do agree with flatlander2, what many refer to as alternative fuels are still carbon-based, so they're not really "alternative". Electric-only power (ie battery) does not seem to be viable for colder climates. Currently, this really only leaves hydrogen power, and where would the oil companies fit into this picture. It would involve a huge investment on their behalf with no real benefit to the bottom line, as long as there is still oil in either the ground or the tar sands.
gasguzlr Champion Author Atlanta Posts:3,002 Points:416,680 Joined:Apr 2003	Message Posted: Apr 24, 2003 9:00:09 AM Ignore gasguzlr Report Abuse i mean...i dont know
gasguzlr Champion Author Atlanta Posts:3,002 Points:416,680 Joined:Apr 2003	Message Posted: Apr 24, 2003 8:59:58 AM Ignore gasguzlr Report Abuse i mean no
gasguzlr Champion Author Atlanta Posts:3,002 Points:416,680 Joined:Apr 2003	Message Posted: Apr 24, 2003 8:59:49 AM Ignore gasguzlr Report Abuse yes
TartanTom Rookie Author Halifax Posts:24 Points:14,975 Joined:Feb 2003	Message Posted: Apr 24, 2003 8:59:06 AM Ignore TartanTom Report Abuse This is a good question? However, considering the wealth of the major oil companies. It would be in the best interest of oil and car companies to slow the progress of various technologies down in order to benefit their own. I think we won't see any major break throughs until oil and gas reserves run out in about 20-25 years.
gasguzlr Champion Author Atlanta Posts:3,002 Points:416,680 Joined:Apr 2003	Message Posted: Apr 24, 2003 8:58:32 AM Ignore gasguzlr Report Abuse that was quite a comparison that skippypgd did with the other liquids that we buy. amazing huh!!??
onedavie Champion Author Virginia Posts:10,301 Points:2,526,590 Joined:Nov 2002	Message Posted: Apr 24, 2003 7:58:50 AM Ignore onedavie Report Abuse NO
wench Rookie Author Atlanta Posts:85 Points:8,345 Joined:Mar 2003	Message Posted: Apr 24, 2003 7:33:58 AM Ignore wench Report Abuse Maybe it's not so much a conspiracy as question of our national values. I've been reading what everyone has been writing and pondering this and I think it comes back to what we really value. We value comfort over the future of our planet.
Fireheat Rookie Author California Posts:32 Points:2,150 Joined:Apr 2003	Message Posted: Apr 23, 2003 11:51:34 PM Ignore Fireheat Report Abuse I voted unsure but I would say Yes.
Pangea Rookie Author Minnesota Posts:60 Points:44,880 Joined:Jun 2002	Message Posted: Apr 23, 2003 10:17:21 PM Ignore Pangea Report Abuse The majority of car buyers today don't care about fuel efficiency in the vehicles they buy so the auto manufacturers have no incentive to produce them. People buy bigger, more comfortable, more luxuriously equipped vehicles and don't care about fuel efficiency so the manufacturers make bigger gas guzzling cars and put in more luxurious equipment and make more money on them. The technology should always be improving to make cars more fuel eficient so why did my 1991 Escort get better gas mileage that my 1998 Escort and why does my 1992 Ranger get better gas mileage than the new ones? US gas is CHEAP, even at $2.00 a gallon it's cheap and there's plenty of it. After the oil embargo in the 70's people were more interested in having better fuel efficiency, now they don't care. Raise the price to $4.00 a gallon like they pay in Europe and you'd see a lot more fuel efficient vehicles on the highway. Detroit wouldn't produce gas guzzlers if no one would buy them.
Chazzer Champion Author Nevada Posts:11,268 Points:2,354,410 Joined:May 2002	Message Posted: Apr 23, 2003 8:01:30 PM Ignore Chazzer Report Abuse Of course there is! I talked about it yesterday.
milo Champion Author Calgary Posts:3,129 Points:833,440 Joined:Aug 2001	Message Posted: Apr 23, 2003 6:31:49 PM Ignore milo Report Abuse yeh to skippypdg!!!!
Schooner Champion Author Toronto Posts:1,727 Points:184,050 Joined:Mar 2003	Message Posted: Apr 23, 2003 3:38:28 PM Ignore Schooner Report Abuse There are some incentives for manufacturers to begin making cleaner cars. Hydrogen seems to be the alternative of choice amongst the big manufacturers. The biggest stumbling block so far has been the question of infrastructure. Mainly, who's going to pick up the tab for making hydrogen available at service stations. As of late western society has begun to see our oil driven economy as a possible future problem. Lets face it, over the last few years Americans have been coming to terms with a few harsh realities. One of them being that they either have to get away from their over-use of petro-based products or face having to defend oil sources such as they have recently done in Iraq. Wars such as this one are expensive and eventually one has to ask 'is this all worth it'. As a note, I don't personally think that oil was the 'only' reason that the US invaded Iraq but lets face it, if Iraq wasn't an oil rich country things would have been done differently. There have already been several measures implemented to get the conversion process underway. Obviously before we start putting in infrastructure you need to have vehicles that are going to use it. Many car manufacturers have been working on hydrogen based cars for years and are very close to having them ready for sale. I personally look forward to the day that hydrogen cars are widely used. Its better for the environment, probably cheaper and we get to the oil companies to "stick it" :-) There are likely others who look forward to doing that too.
JoyceM Rookie Author Las Vegas Posts:1 Points:220 Joined:Apr 2003	Message Posted: Apr 23, 2003 2:09:06 PM Ignore JoyceM Report Abuse Check out thid web site re:alternative fuel. www.biodiesel.org
Smiles77 Champion Author Calgary Posts:1,648 Points:146,155 Joined:Jan 2003	Message Posted: Apr 23, 2003 1:56:49 PM Ignore Smiles77 Report Abuse I believe that there is far more advanced technology out there than what we are seeing.
dslman Rookie Author Portland Posts:1 Points:120 Joined:Apr 2003	Message Posted: Apr 23, 2003 1:56:09 PM Ignore dslman Report Abuse I agree with PetroHawk's last submission. The conspirators are the general public. I do not support the government, but they do have grant programs for developing alternative fuel technologies. As an employee at a major manufacturer of long-haul trucks I can say this with confidence. As for Joe Public- if you cannot make your own decisions on which vehicle you drive (and the technology it uses) you have only yourself to blame. You are the conspirator.